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[Sweden]: Call to Italy

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"I am so sorry to hear about this event. Diplomatic staff should never be used as a way to punish a country that one dislikes. If you want to send a clear message you close their embassy and send them home but you never commit such a horrible crime. A multinational cooperation does sound interesting.

I briefly mentioned some areas but I'll go a bit further into them.

A double criminality standard, meaning that a country doesn't have to extradite someone for something that isn't covered by a similar law in the country.

No extradition for crimes that are deemed political by either party. No extradition if the country that is extraditing the prisoner believes that the person will not receive a fair trial or will be too harshly punished, for example torture or the death penalty, if a country does not allow such punishments."
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"Yes, it was traumatising and in the simplist of terms these people were administrators, they're not diplomats, they're just civilians performing working-class roles on behalf of their country... it was a harrowing experience and a grotesque abuse of political power.

We are strong followers of the Declaration on Human Rights so the arrangement for a fair trial and harsh punishment is completely understandable - none of those signing the future agreement will be operators of extreme judicial systems, I can assure you that. I can agree with the double criminality standard on the basis that the accused's country of origin is kept informed on legal proceedings at appropriate intervals or by request through their detention, after all they are considered innocent until proven guilty. I am however intrigued on the basis of political crimes, are you able to elaborate on what type of offences would be determined as 'political'?"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"While the definition of political crimes can be a bit broad, consisting things such as treason, sedition and terrorism. I mainly mean when the country that receives the extradition request believes that such charges are being made not from a legal standpoint, but a political standpoint. For example stamping a member of the opposition as having committed treason or sedition for not cooperating with the government. But this could also be used to protect for example a whistle-blower from being extradited. I assume that for a lot of country's making these rules is not necessary, but we still find it very important to protect people from such extradition. Of course the specific wording of such an exemption in the agreement is up to discussion, but I hope that you are able to understand from where I'm coming and what my goal is with it."
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"Ah, I understand now, your vision is to protect the accused in the event that the requesting government has... less than appropriate plans. I absolutely agree with you but think the political crimes tag will be used and abused by less trustworthy states to refuse to extradite those held unlawfully in another state - to combat this event I think that any state executing the 'political crime' clause must then consult with an independent body such as the Global Assembly or International Court of Justice to ensure a fair trial, would this satisfy your concerns?"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Exactly. I also see how such an exemption could indeed be used by countries against the purpose of this agreement. I believe so, of course treason on unground basis can also be denied under a mutual crime exemption, and the ability to consult with such a body would be good as it protects both states, allowing for a fair judgement of the extradition request. Do you have any scale to the size of this agreement, in terms of countries, and timeframe as to when it will be signed at the moment? And will it be within Europe for now or are you looking for global cooperation on this issue?"
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"At this stage it is very much an 'expression of interest' process, the Department of Foreign Affairs has tasked all Ambassadors within Europe to seek the opinion of their respective host nation and see what points they're concerned about, what they want detailed in the agreement and what would require negotiation. The plan is to use all our collected data, with the nations the agree to proceed with extradition cooperation, and draft an agreement which meets everyones expectations - it will focus on Europe for phase one but I don't see any reason why we cannot try to extend this worldwide over time. I have noted the areas you'd like the agreement to detail clearly and I'll send this back to the Department of Foreign Affairs for analysis. In all honesty, the timeframe for this kind of large-scale project is entirely down to how fast we can negotiate and draft an agreement with Europe... I will keep you updated as much as I can must we're very much in the early years of making this happen. One thing is for sure though. This is a first on the globe and we're making history... for the better."

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Well, you can put Italy on the list of countries interested together with the points we discussed and I hope with that we can bring forth a good and fair deal. I look forward to hearing more about it and am willing to assist in any way necessary. Indeed, as crossing the border becomes easier it is also important that we extend the rule of law so people can be held accountable for their crimes so I am glad that we can work on such an agreement together. I believe that concludes the extredition,
unless you have anything else you want to discuss about it?"
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"Absolutely, I will place you firmly on the list and we will be in touch to inform you of any changes to ensure we all remain in the loop. No, no, I agree, that concludes extradition. Are there any subjects you wish to discuss today?"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Perhaps we could discuss tourist visas? Italy is currently promoting a program of on-arrival visas for tourist purposes to make it easier for tourists to travel from and to Italy to increase tourism. Is this something that your country would consider?"
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"That certainly sounds interesting, we currently have a very strict visa system as a result of the Allemannsrett Area agreement governing the visa process in Norway, Sweden and Denmark, I would be intrgiued as to how this process could be integrated into the system we already have - do you have any more information?"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Italy currently has one such deal done, and is working on a few more. But it entails a system that removes the need for pre-approved visa's for tourist stays for up to one month, or a different specified duration. Meaning that a tourist visa is applied for and given upon arrival on the airport by a border agent, and they are then also entered into the system so we know who is in Italy. The border agent has the authority to give someone such a visa after just seeing a passport, but can also want more information such as stay, plans, if they have enough money if they suspect someone is not actually traveling for tourist purposes, and they then also have the right to send such a person back. This only applies to the Italian citizens and the citizens of the country that the deal is with between those two countries, so the other deals that Italy has have no influence on travel to Sweden.

By doing this we lower the barrier to travel for tourists with the goal to advance tourism to and from Italy for mutual economic benefit."
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"I do think this sounds reasonable under the circumstances, it should be noted that Sweden has some fairly strict visa requirements but this definitely something we could streamline to face-to-face visa grants. I would like to be assured that these persons would still be subject to the normal security checks and procedures of their person and luggage prior to departure and subsequent arrival in Sweden? They certainly would be treated like any other passenger from the Swedish side when departing for Italy. Is this something you have an agreement already drafted for so I could read over it?"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"I understand the worries. What are the points that you feel are important as requirements for visa's so we can see if we can incorporate that into a possible agreement. Of course, airport security is in no way compromised. We just fuse the applying for a visa, which was usually done in advance, and the checking of the visa by the border agent into one process overseen by the border agency. The regular luggage and on person checks remain the same. I have a rough draft that I will fax over to you now."

FAX
PRIVATE AND ENCRYPTED
VISA AGREEMENT
  1. Italian citizens wishing to visit Sweden for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Italian passport.
  2. Swedish citizens wishing to visit Italy for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Korean passport.
  3. Border agents have the right to ask the person applying for such a visa for more details about their travel, and have the ultimate authority to approve or deny such a request.
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"My main worry was security but given that this is not a visa-free process and we retain the capability to deny applicants at the border then I see no real deficiency in the process in all honesty. I am happy with the arrangements detailed, providing that Swedish nationals aren't required to provide Korean passports as detailed in clause two because that would be... a challenge to say the least!"

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Exactly, we are hesitant with visa-free processes for now as it is too much of a risk while we don't know what other countries are doing, so it is better to make it easier for tourists while retaining a fully border agency with visa's for everyone. And apologies, the clauses were taken from a similar deal that we have with the Koreans and I just saw that I forgot to change that out." The minister chuckled a bit, striping out Korean for Swedish.​
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
Having forwarded the agreement to the Department of Foreign Affairs, it would return a short white later signed by the Secretary of Foreign Affairs.

FAX
PRIVATE AND ENCRYPTED
VISA AGREEMENT
  1. Italian citizens wishing to visit Sweden for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Italian passport.
  2. Swedish citizens wishing to visit Italy for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Swedish passport.
  3. Border agents have the right to ask the person applying for such a visa for more details about their travel, and have the ultimate authority to approve or deny such a request.

    Signed:
    Margot Wallström, Secretary of Foreign Affairs, Kingdom of Sweden
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
The fax was then signed by the Italian Minister and returned to Sweden, putting the agreement into effect.

FAX
PRIVATE AND ENCRYPTED
VISA AGREEMENT
  1. Italian citizens wishing to visit Sweden for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Italian passport.
  2. Swedish citizens wishing to visit Italy for a period of no longer than 30 days for tourist reasons can apply for a visa on arrival, requiring only a valid Swedish passport.
  3. Border agents have the right to ask the person applying for such a visa for more details about their travel, and have the ultimate authority to approve or deny such a request.
Signed:
Margot Wallström, Secretary of Foreign Affairs, Kingdom of Sweden
Lamberto Dini, Minister of Foreign Affairs, Italian Republic

Connor
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Another topic I would like to shortly discuss on behalf of my minister of defence is the possible acquisition of Swedish made armoured personnel carriers, in specific the Bandvagn 206S for use with our Alpine units of our Italian Army, who specialize in mountainous terrain and lack a proper all-terrain vehicle. We hope Sweden can provide this to give us ability to operate within the Alps and other mountainous terrain. As for specifics, if the product is for sale Italy is looking at around 300 units, is this something Sweden could provide?"
 

Connor

Kingdom of Sweden
Moderator
GA Member
Jul 23, 2018
4,221
"Ah, yes, the Bandvagn 206S - truly a staple of Swedish innovation and development but unfortunately the designer, Hagglunds, has since been sold to BAE Systems in the United Kingdom and presumably since dissolved into Nexus Defence... As much as I'd love to develop these domestically for you I'm sure you can appreciate that Great Britain has long been a close partner to Sweden and we wouldn't want to damage that with an off-the-books defence sale. I can only encourage you to seek the sale via Nexus Defence."

Tim
 

Tim

Kingdom of the Netherlands
Dec 25, 2020
1,059
"Oh well, I fully understand your reasoning. I believe there have been talks with NEXUS so I am sure our minister of defence can add this to the list of equipment he wants to buy. Thank you very much for the information. That was the last thing that I specifically wanted to discuss, is there anything else that you feel the need to discuss or shall we end the call? Either way let me tell you that it has been a pleasure working with you for the mutual good of our countries and I look forward to our future cooperation."
 

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